[Mrs.Smith]

Hi everyone.

Wanted to get some general career advice from strangers on the Internet. To start off with a little background, I have been a senior financial analyst in the FP&A department of a large software company for almost two years now. Prior to that I was a senior auditor at a large regional firm and spent a few years at as an accountant at an unrelated company (banking). In other words, I have been at the lead senior/non manager level for about 4 years, but have not yet crossed over.

I have always been recognized as a top performer, have been selected to take on challenging projects and been charged with training others (many times). I usually give my all when on boarding or training someone new and try to do everything that I wish my managers had done for me. Although it sounds very conceited, I think that I am unusually good at explaining concepts, generating and freely sharing innovative ideas and empowering others. As you can imagine, over time this results in feeling like I have given away all my ideas, have provided training and mentorship like I have never received from a manager and constantly find my ideas coming out of other people’s mouths (Co workers, managers, trainees).

I have had the painful experience of working under 2 inexperienced managers in the past who were in the early stages of establishing themselves. They all seemed to manage the same way…. hoarding information, keeping their staff in the background and taking credit for all work generated by the team. I have never seen any other approach!

To make a long story short, my team was reorganized to fall under another department (power struggle at top management level) and my current manager did not move with our group. My new manager is a senior director who is extremely “hands off” due to demands on her time. Honestly, I see her maybe once a week. I have also been training our other team member for the past year, but am not her manager.

I can already feel the tension building within our small two person team as we posture to expand our roles and responsibilities. I have been in this situation twice before where I train and mentor the crap out of someone just to elevate them to the senior level, but don’t move out of senior myself.

I feel shiesty not including my tesm member on e-mails or inviting her to meetings that I think she could learn from (even as a silent participant), so I always include her. I feel like I am shooting myself in the foot and have already given away any “platform” I could have built to eventually work my way into a management opportunity.

To those who have made it to manager in industry, let’s not bullshit each other: how did you make the transition to manager? Honestly! What can I do to make this time THE time.

Sincerely,

Pseudo manager

[Anonymous]

Many times the easiest way to move to manager is to move to a new company and come in as the manager. When you're the top-performing senior, to move you to manager would mean losing their star-senior. They'd have a big gap in the Senior FP&A role if you were a manager. But, if you apply to a Manager role, then it's a company that wants a Manager, and may see you as the perfect candidate.

Personally, that's how I moved into a managerial role. That being said, it was for awhile a pseudo-managerial, then a truly-managerial, then a half-and-half. I'm the Controller at a college, but when I got here, the “Business Office” (HR, Student Accounts, AP, Accounting, and a couple other things) had a very flat organizational structure – everyone reported directly to the VP/CFO. However, he told me early on that he wanted to change that so that the accounting/AP people started reporting to me instead. On a practical basis, they did most of the time, but to change it officially too. So, about a year after I got here, we officially transitioned it. As a small department, though, that meant I had a grand total of 2 direct reports. Then we downsized the department, which included eliminating one of the positions that reported to me, and modifying the duties of someone else who didn't report to me, so now I have one official direct report and 1 other person who officially reports to the VP/CFO but who does the same work as my prior direct report and who functionally reports to me. So, I totally understand your pseudo-manager spot, since I basically have 2 employees, one official and one note, and until a few months ago I had 2 or 3 employees depending on the time, and all were unofficial. 😐 But, the way I got this role was being hired into it from the outside, and I really doubt I would have been promoted into it from inside the organization. You're always waiting for a manager to leave (which hopefully doesn't happen often!), and then you have one shot at it, and if you're looked over for that one shot, you've got to wait again. Looking outside, you've got a lot more options.

Since I wasn't promoted from within, I'm not sure what advice to give for promotions from within, except for extreme patience. My dad was promoted from within, though that was also many years ago (back in the early 90's) and in a different field. In his case, he didn't have a degree, and the managerial role required a degree. So, when the Director position was vacant, he helped direct things and filled the role while they sought a new candidate for it, then helped train the new guy, then the new guy failed a bit later, and the cycle repeated, then they got a guy who lasted a couple years, then the cycle repeated, etc., till finally the Director's boss was like “Hey Lilla's Dad, since you're the one really doing the work more often than not, how about you do this on an official interim basis, and if it works well, we'll let you keep the job?” It worked out – Dad busted butt, proved his abilities, kept the title, and later was moved to the larger location of the company doing the same job, then when his boss moved a couple states south to a new company a few years later and had an opening for the same position, his then-former boss changed the job description to not require a degree, called my dad, and said “Hey, would you be willing to move south?” So, my dad managed the internal promotion method, because he wasn't qualified officially to get hired in from outside, and his qualifications were completely performance-based. However, he had to train several other people in their job and have them fail before he was considered for the position, and even then it took a higher-up with an open mind for him to be considered for it. Many aren't that willing to consider people who don't fit their cookie-cutter mold. There could be something at your current job that the company expects for the manager position that you don't have, but that another company wouldn't mind you not having.

[Mrs.Smith]

Thank you for sharing! I thought after I got my CPA, it would be smooth sailing straight to the CFO office 😉 Guess not…

I actually thought that it would be more difficult to be hired on as a manager at a new company without previous mgnt experience. Almost all of the recruiters that contact me are hiring for other Senior FP&A positions. I don't think I have ever been contacted for a manager position, so not sure how willing most companies are to take a chance. Aside from my frustration over my lack foreseeable growth, I do find my work incredibly mentally challenging… so there's that.
Am I considering setting up some 1:1 time with my new director, but want to be sure I frame the conversation well… and don't come off whiney and entitled.

Anyone been in a similar situation?

[Ginja_CPA]

So I think they way you are approaching things is good. I personally believe that you should always give credit to those who deserve it. If my manager takes all of the credit, and I'm a “star” employee, they will soon see me leave. I agree with Lilla, sometimes the best way up is by going somewhere else.

I would probably take the time to talk to the people that promote and see why you're being passed over. Let them know what you've done for the company, and how going into a more managerial position will benefit not only your growth, but also the companies.

I read a book one time that is called “The Speed of Trust” by Stephen M.R. Covey, you might give it a read as it is a very beneficial book about management.

AUD - 83
BEC - 78
FAR - 80
REG - 80

If at first you don't succeed, destroy all evidence that you tried!

REG: 80 (02/19/16)
AUD: 83 (04/11/16)
BEC: 78 (05/28/16)
FAR: ?

[Anonymous]

One thought relative to the meeting – they may not be aware that you want to be in management. There's a lot of people that want to be exactly where they are. So, if you wanted to be less confrontational, you could approach the meeting as “I'd love to move into a managerial role, can you give me some pointers of what I would need to do to be considered for such a role in this company?”, and that make them start thinking of you in a managerial way if they hadn't already been doing so.

As far as the recruiters…they're not likely to reach out to you for a step up, you'll likely have to find the step up positions yourself. However, just because recruiters aren't reaching out to you for them doesn't mean that they won't consider you for them. When a recruiter is reaching out, they're looking for someone whose current job indicates they're familiar with the work and interested in the work that the recruiter is looking to fill, so they're probably looking for someone with the exact same job title. (Remember, recruiters often recruit for many different areas, so may not even know exactly what is covered in the job you're doing compared to the one they're recruiting for, unless they're the same job exactly.)

[mtaylo24]

I made Accounting manager at my last company by waiting it out. I knew that position had high turnover, and I even left about 2 years of being in that role. I always worked directly with the CFO and Controller, so I knew it would just be a matter of time. (took me about 3 years to get into that position). Was an Accounting lead about a year prior to.

CPA (2017)

REG:  75

BEC:  76

FAR:  77

AUD: 78

 

CMA (2019)

P1: 380

P2: 360

AUD - 1st - 60 (12/12), 61 (2/13), 61 (8/13), 78! (11/15)
REG - 55 (2/16) 69 (5/16) Retake(8/16)
BEC - 71(5/16) Retake (9/16)
FAR - (8/16)

[Missy]

This is not what you want to hear but have you considered that you are so good where you are currently and provide such a benefit (all the perks to them of you being a manager without the title or salary) that they're comfy keeping you right where you are.

Old timer,  A71'er since 2010.

Finance manager/HR manager

 

 

Licensed Massachusetts Non Reporting CPA since 2012
Finance/Admin/HR Manager

[Anonymous]

I have absolutely no idea what your true situation is, but It may be there's some truth to MLA's comment – you can get labeled as a “worker” versus “manager.” Be careful what you wish for – what makes you think. you'd be happy doing that work? You may be able to leverage your other significant strengths into something of value (i.e., something that gives someone reason to pay you managerial pay without the manager job.). IT or Project Management skills for example.

[kcrc]

I've been going through the same thing for the last several years. I worked for three years under a great boss as a divisional accountant. He brought me in on informational meetings and his philosophy was that the more I knew, the more I could take off his plate and the more he could contribute on a strategic level. Three years ago we underwent a restructuring where I landed under another boss who had no idea what I do and said I was to just keep doing the processes I was doing. I was put out to pasture and forgotten about. It's been the worst stretch in my career – including being laid off during the recession – because I've totally stagnated and aged out of the Senior level. I run into the chicken-egg conundrum where I want to get into management, but I don't have any management experience.

While I've achieved exactly zero success in my career or gotten close to getting out of the pasture, I had to have an annual review with my deadbeat boss (before another restructuring). I got angry about my predicament and let him have it and told him that he completely mismanaged me, that he was unapproachable, that he had a closed door policy, and that I had won an outstanding employee achievement award before being thrown in a dumpster. Now nobody likes to hear that they aren't people-persons so he took it all very well and even offered to bring me into his office once a week to discuss healthcare finance (a horribly complicated topic that's not taught in schools and represents a huge barrier to getting into management).

[Author]

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