[Anonymous]

I have been debating about whether to make the jump to Big Four or not lately. My wife and I aren’t planning to have children for another two to three years, so I have been thinking now may be the best time to do it and get the experience and prestige that comes with it.

I do know that I most likely won’t make a career out of it, based on what I have heard. I really would be using it for the opportunities that it will create down the line for me, especially if and when I make the jump to private.

My questions are for those either in Big Four or have previous Big Four experience, preferably those that have worked in NYC or Long Island, NY (where I will be looking). Can you describe your experience? How was the pay increase from where you had been to going to Big Four? What are the busy season and non busy season hours like (Are they dreadful all year round, and is tax season really until midnight or 1 am every night?) Was there any resemblance of some sort of work life balance or did you really have no life? What did you like most out of it? How were the people? Why did you leave?

Any input and advice is greatly appreciated! Thanks guys.

[subie_rex]

Hey what's up man. Hopefully this can give you some insight. I just left a big 4 firm here in NYC metro area after just getting promoted to Senior Tax associate. I obviously can't speak to every industry, but I worked in financial services (hedge funds, private equity, REITS etc). The winter busy season wasn't that bad. I was averaging around 50-60 hours a week. However the summer was entirely different. I was averaging 70-80 every week from mid July to the September 15th deadline. The last week before the 15th I literally charged almost 100 hours. It was insane. Keep in mind I worked for a very challenging client that was very needy and we were insanely understaffed for the engagement.

I would say work/life essentially doesn't exist. But I took this job for the same reason you are considering: to get the experience and prestige with NO plan on staying long-term. I'm glad i did it. Now my wife and I will start a family after getting a great job that I'm sure my Big 4 experience provided. You just have to be cool with your life sucking for the next two years.

The challenge and experience was great. I really enjoyed working on a hedge fund client. That's the type of experience only big 4 can provide.

Lastly, I will say don't let them try to make you stay longer than you want by throwing money at you. I nearly fell for it but realized if I stayed in this role it would ruin my life – haha.

BEC-86 (07/07/12)
FAR-87(08/25/12)
AUD-93(10/08/12)
REG-87(11/17/12)

[subie_rex]

I forgot to mention one thing: the hours I could handle…it was the stress and loneliness that my wife had to go through that made me decide to leave. It was killing me seeing her so sad. It really terrified me that this stupid job could literally be creating a rift between me and my wife that I couldn't potentially not fix.

Keep that in mind man…

BEC-86 (07/07/12)
FAR-87(08/25/12)
AUD-93(10/08/12)
REG-87(11/17/12)

[Anonymous]

Here's the short answer – every situation is different. Here's the long answer –

Don't come to big4 public accounting if you don't enjoy the work and don't enjoy putting in the hours to get a finished product. I'm not saying you have to adore accounting and eat, breathe, live accounting, but in general the people who do well here are the people who actually enjoy new projects and new clients and different challenges. However, don't forget it's public accounting. There are ranks and procedures everyone must go through. At the bottom of the totem pole you will not be surrounded by extremely interesting work and you will have to put in hours. There are long training sessions, there's travel, there's plenty of things that mess up your day to day that you have to be willing to adapt to.

Now, the poster above said he's in financial services, which regardless of which B4 is a very busy department in general. The truth is your schedule will depend on what line you're in and what clients you have. There are people who completely avoid the “horror” of busy season by having clients/teams that are extremely efficient and pre-work begins early. Then there are clients where quarterlies roll into year end roll into provision/audit and you basically are busy season 9/12 months no matter how hard everyone works. Throw in random pbc woes and you have a recipe for late nights. It happens. It will always depend on your firm, market, office, team, client, etc. There's no hard and fast rule.

I'm married, kids, B4 NYC metro, and I absolutely have a life outside of work lol. A pretty darn good one at that. Just understand why you're getting into B4 and weigh the pros and cons. If getting a by the book 9-5 job is what fits your life best, do that. That is not B4. But B4 is so much more than hours and work.. the network of people you meet on both sides and all of the career opportunities and social events are such an added bonus. I'm not even trying to sell B4, just trying to paint an honest portrayal that isn't all doom and gloom because some 23 year old staff hates making copies. Well no shit.

[Anonymous]

Well that's the thing. I just want to make sure I have some sort of life/any resemblance of life (not working every Saturday of the year, and not working too many seven day weeks during busy season). I guess everyone's situation is different there depending on what department you are in and all. Anyone have any say as to which firm out of the four is least taxing (no pun intended)?

[UM1868]

I do it for the experience. That is it.

Bec-76 (7/14)
Aud-81 (8/14)
Reg-82 (7/15)
Far- 82 (10/15)

Moral of the story, don't do your CPA while working in Big 4 Public Accounting.

[The Ex Lurker]

This might be a dumb question but are all B4 entry level positions paid salary or per hour with OT pay? I've heard of salaried pay, say 52k/annum. So that equates to 1k/wk. when working 70hrs one week, they essentially got paid $14.29/hr that week. Am I thinking this through correctly?

F: Apr 14' Passed
A: May 14' Passed
R: Jul 14' Passed
B: Aug 14' Rematch in Oct *Passed*

[Anonymous]

Digi – B4 isn't for you. You are getting some of (if not the) best opportunities in terms of experience, networking, and resume building. You can't expect not to make sacrifices on your end. You're sipping the online hate koolaid a bit much. B4 is not a dungeon of endless hours and thankless work. However, going in with the mentality of “I don't want too much of..” and “If I can avoid..” will make your stay here very short. The B4 are all comparable, there is no lite B4. You can have a very real control of how much “life” you have, but you also have to have responsibility for your work. But please don't believe that work every Saturday garbage you see on reddit and other places. Pretty much everyone for November/December is going home at 5 every day.

[Anonymous]

The b4 are all the same. It may depend more on the location of your office (e.g. Orange County, CA vs Los Angeles, CA)

But bigfourexpert is pretty spot on.

I'm in tax, and I've been going home at 5 since 10/15 and haven't worked a weekend since, and don't expect to until provision YE time rolls along.

[Anonymous]

How about the travel? I have heard stories of people traveling and staying in location for three to four months at a time. Do the auditor's travel a lot and for that long of a duration? How common is it?

[Jstubb]

As all the previous experienced B4 posts have mentioned, it honestly varies….. every firm, location, client is different. But please hear them when they say : B4 or public accounting in general takes “hard work, sacrifice, and self-discipline”. In my personal experience, I believe it is an excellent learning tool by exposing you to numerous industries and clients. It is extremely competitive, especially at staff / senior levels….it can be dog eat dog because the “better” your are the “better” clients you will get bc the managers / partners will see the dedication and work you're willing / able to do in order to provide a great client service. And no matter what client I was on (which fortunately, I had some great clients bc I worked hard to get them), my busy seasons (audit = mid Jan thru April) were minimum 55 hours but up to some 80+ hours in order to meet the deadlines (maybe 5 weeks). however, I never ever worked passed 5:30 on a Friday, even during all busy seasons, it was an unspoken rule firm wide. You're treated like a true professional in that you can have the flexibility and control to work from home late at night or on weekends, but you must act like a professional and dedicate yourself to your employer who is paying you to provide a service. Regarding travel;: Little travel for me personally bc I was on some great clients and choose good staff….others – not so lucky.

If you are going to do it – interview with the firms in your area, research their culture (many seem to be catering to a work/life balance for the new generations), research their clients……ask / research if client locations are out of town. Be honest with your questions if you want to know the truth because they will be vetting you based on your q's and the interview process as well. Also – do it while you are young, especially if you just want the prestige. Burnout and turnover seems to by 2 years. I stayed almost 5 years then had the Firm provide a transfer internationally that was an amazing experience for me.

@Luker: the B4 / public accounting salary is typically below corporate / private corp salary (usually not a major significance, but it is lower) …..and never calculate your hourly pay….especially w busy season. Remember tho, Public accounting invests a lot and I mean a lot of $$$$ on you personally through training costs, travel costs, etc.

Good luck!

AUD: Nov2014 81
FAR: Jan2015
BEC: Feb2015
REG: Apr2015
Using Becker

[wannabeCPA123]

If you come from industry or a mid-tier. I wouldn't move into the Big 4.

SOX has gotten out-of-control. You now spend the majority of your time writing Novels on test of controls and 50-60 page walkthrough reports even for fixed assets.

if a control reviewer uses 10 reports in his/her report, guess what? you have to intricately document every completeness and accuracy procedure done over every report, then inspect every document to see that there is evidence of not only review procedures but also the Completeness and Accuracy procedures. Then you have to re-perform EVERY detail in the review procedure and document for all ten reports. Not just the Review procedures, but all the Completeness and Accuracy procedures for the reports have to be re-performed.

It's too much. I didn't major in accounting to be a novelist. I just don't see the value in it anymore.

And what value do we offer to private industry now? It seems like all we do is write these HUGE walkthroughs and TOC reports, and it really doesn't transfer to anything tangible in private industry.

Stay away from the big four.

FAR 78
REG 87
BEC 78
AUD 78
Passed all exams on first try! Good luck to everyone!

[fuzyfro89]

It's unpredictable, so don't look for a cut and dry guarantee of what your experience will be. It doesn't exist.

Audit may OR may not have a lot of travel. Everything depends on your clients.

Say it with me: Everything depends on my clients. Everything depends on my clients. Everything depends on my clients.

If you are willing to put up with some bullsh*t, some fun colleagues, some annoying managers and partners, some 3-4 months where you will work 55+ hours/week, then it could be for you. The “prestige” as you call it does exist and opens many doors. of course, you still need to be a good candidate for any future job as it's not magic potion to your career; however, it's fairly easy to get at least someone to look at your resume.

Big 4 public + private/industry experience is a great combination and will allow lots of flexibility in your career.

I had some good and some negative experiences during my 2 years in Big 4 audit, but it did help my career. In the world of careers, perception is everything, so we can save the argument whether Big 4 experience is “actually better than mid/small firm experience” for another day. The fact is, the perception and brand is better and that counts for a little, a good bit, or sometimes a LOT.

Hope this helps. If you like predictability and can't handle stress, it's not for you. If you can deal with it for a while, then go for it.

[Author]

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