[Anonymous]

Let me start off with some background…I knew by my junior year in undergrad that public accounting wasn’t for me. But I felt that because I didn’t want to go into public accounting I was almost ostracized by professors and other students, and would get backhanded compliments like “well just make sure you aren’t selling yourself short”. It was made clear to me that supposedly anyone who wants to be anybody will start out in public accounting.

Fast forward…I got a job in a mid-sized manufacturing company right out of college working in A/P and overseeing our corporate credit card and expense reimbursement program. I transitioned into a staff accountant role 9 months later. In June I will have been here 3 years and I LOVE MY JOB! Working in a mid-sized company, I have gotten so many opportunities because our department isn’t all that big. Plus, I rarely work over 40 hours/week and the culture is amazing here. Our President (former CFO), CFO, and Controller all have ZERO public accounting experience. Our former Controller and Assistant Controller both did and will tell you that they don’t think it’s necessary to your career to start out in public. In fact, in interviewing for a new Assistant Controller, we were looking more for someone with industry experience over public experience because working in public is nothing like working in a mid-sized company.

That being said…I’m genuinely curious about what makes working in public so great, what doors it opens, why it’s worth going through busy seasons, etc. I obviously have a one-sided opinion and I want to understand the other side! If you know in the long run you aren’t on the partner track, is it really so great to have public experience on your resume?

[NeedsA75]

FWIW, my friend is a CPA and has been working in assurance for the past 7 years and is having difficulty switching to private industry accounting due to his lack of experience in industry accounting..

AUD - 96
BEC - 86
FAR - 76
REG - 92

PETH - 92
Licensed in California

 

[NotYourAverageCPA]

I spent 2 summers as an intern, and then 2.5 years in both advisory and tax at one of the large public firms. The exposure to different industries plus the flexibility to try something new if you get bored is very valuable. To me you can write your own ticket by learning and developing skills that are important to you (granted you speak up for yourself and take risks). Though I would recommend leaving after becoming Senior if you do not plan on being in public til partner. I left for industry and have not looked back.

• BEC - Pass Feb 2014
• AUD - Pass Feb 2014
• REG - Pass April 2014
• FAR- Pass May 2014

Licensed CPA - Jan 2016

• CISA - Pass June 2016
• CRISC - Pass December 2016

 

FAR - PASS
AUD - PASS
REG - PASS
BEC - PASS

NY CPA- Licensed Jan 2016
CISA Exam - Passed June 2016

[Anonymous]

It is what you make of it. It is one of those professions where you get out what you put in. Some people go into work everyday like zombie robots and that is all they need to lead a fulfilling life.

On the other hand, there are others who want to do more with their experience and life and they will find it most difficult in public accounting since advancement and office culture is structured in such a way that rewards people who strictly adhere to rules and checklists and deadlines rather than the more entrepreneurial business minded type of accountants.

It is valuable experience though if you want to work in a specific industry and work on those industry specific clients i.e. technology, healthcare, real estate, professional services, non-profit clients, etc.

[Anonymous]

I do see how it gives you exposure to a wide variety of industries…and that could be especially good for a new grad that isn't sure where they want to take their career. That way they don't pidgeonhole themselves in an industry/field they don't like.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but it seems like it's key to get out at the right time. In public you may get exposure to certain things, but the difference is you aren't actually doing the work to gain the experience. You're reviewing somebody else's work. So while it may give you an understanding of how processes all work together, it isn't giving you the hands-on experience needed to actually get the job done once you're in industry. If you stay in public until you're a manager and expect to jump right into a management/controller position in industry, that's quite a stretch IMO simply because the experience isn't the same.

[oldercandidate21]

I had several job offers to choose from at graduation and the lowest paying one was at a Big 4 firm, while the others were all in industry. All of my professors stressed to take an opportunity at a national firm if presented one, so I took it. After two years I decided that I work-to-live, and didn’t live-to-work. That and I wasn’t learning much. I was traveling like crazy from one project to the next doing staff level work (ie formatting data and footing workpapers). So after three years I left public for industry. And it was the best decision that I ever made.

I have been at my current position for the it’s hard to say 11 years now, and hold a managerial position at a fortune 200 company. I learned more in 1 year on the job than I did in 3 years in public. With that being said my personality is one where I like to really learn the ins and outs of something. This environment can only be found while working for a single company. In public I always just saw bits and pieces and never really got to view the whole picture.

With that being said, I do suggest getting in at least a few years in public. And I say that because of the perception. Almost every job rec I see states that “public experience” is required and “CPA, Masters or JD” preferred. I don’t agree with this prerequisite, but it is what it is. That’s why I decided to get licensed. You never know what may happen and I’d rather have it and not need it, than need it and not have it… but remember this about Public, it’s like a runaway train, you just got to know when to jump off

FAR 75
BEC 81
AUD 71, 84
REG 69, 71, 83

FAR - 75 November 2015
REG - 69 April 2016 (WTH? Test I got isn't what I studied for)
BEC - 81 June 2016
AUD - TBD

[Anonymous]

So my question is…why do universities seem to push so hard for accounting majors to start out at a Big 4 firm? It's almost like Big 4s and universities are in cahoots because no one would actually be crazy enough to choose to work those hours without some prompting.

I still don't understand what makes public experience so great. Is the just the opportunity to make connections and familiarize yourself with a lot of companies so you can figure out where you fit in the long run? To me it seems more about the prestige than anything.

[Anonymous]

They are in cahoots. It is all another cog in the wheel of the establishment. It is true, it offers the best opportunity for accountants, but only the best of the best will make it to the top. That doesn't mean there aren't other outside opportunities that offer better pay to attract those high quality big 4 employees who put in the time.

It's kinda like Becker Review too. It's not necessarily the best, but they are in cahoots with all the universities… that's why their prices are jacked. Business as usual.

We're all pawns/puppets in the grand scheme of the establishment until we make it to those positions of power and influence.

And yes, that's what makes the big 4 so great. The networking opportunities, future job prospects, and typically more complex nature of accounting work you're exposed to due to the nature/size of the clients. It's more or less like a fraternity/sorority basically. With all the people and resources available as a big 4 employee/alumni, you get out what you put in.

[HoosierCPA]

@allie I've always been curious on this as well. I have a similar road as you–went to a school where the big 4 was the only option. I knew it was never for me, one because my grades weren't there and 2 I knew about the long hours. Out of college, like you, I landed a manufacturing job…fairly large (600M sub and 6B globally). We get audited by a big 4 so I deal first hand with them. One of my favorite questions is how they enjoy their job…basically none say they enjoy it, they either hate it or its just “ok”. Many are like the ones on this site, just trying to survive till they hit senior then they will be on their way.

My question is–does 4 years in public trump 4 years in my position? That's something I have always wondered…assuming I stuck with manufacturing, I would feel my background is more strong…but who knows!?

Another poster mentioned it above that public accounting is whatever you make it. I have dealt with extremely bright big 4 employees, but unfortunately I would say the majority get so caught up in making sure documentation matches the prior year documentation that they don't use their brain.In fact I have seen some that struggle with a basic journal entry, they will pull out a piece of paper and write out their t table and try to figure out how a cash entry works — and these are CPA's!

I'm like @allie I love my job, and appreciate the exposure it has give me..I see all sides of the accounting process, anywhere from basic AR AP, to forecasting, budgeting, month end close, to high level analysis. I don't feel like my accounting would be nearly as strong if I went the big 4 route…but I could be wrong..I will never know.

I'm not trying to bash on the big 4, more so curious about peoples thoughts, like @allie.

AUD - 80
BEC - 82
FAR - 78
REG - 89

...

FAR - 78
REG - 72,74,71...please just go away REG nobody likes you!
BEC - 82
AUD - Aug 16

[Missy]

The impression I've gotten (never worked in public) is that industry jobs value public experience because an experienced auditor will anticipate all year long what questions the auditors are going to ask during the rollforward or at year end.

I've worked in industry jobs where the accounting manager is virtually SCRAMBLING to find all the backup that the auditors request, and it just looks bad not to mention the auditors are billing their time while they're waiting for someone to find the purchase order to match to the copier machine invoice. Also someone with audit experience is more likely to push back a bit or question an auditor. I've seen very new auditors request documentation and my manager with audit experience would discuss their reasons with them enough to realize they weren't actually looking for the full depreciation schedule just for one particular asset class at that point. Friends in audit have confirmed to me if everybody doing field work happens to be first or second year they actually do depend to some extent on the knowledge of management at the company they're auditing. The key I was taught is never give an auditor more than they ask for and it's a mistake someone like me without audit experience is more likely to make than a controller with audit background.

Old timer,  A71'er since 2010.

Finance manager/HR manager

 

 

Licensed Massachusetts Non Reporting CPA since 2012
Finance/Admin/HR Manager

[CPYay]

mla nailed it. Most auditors doing the leg work are new and don't know much more than the staff accountants at the company they're auditing. People tend to think that because they're auditors, they know better. Fact is, they may be slowing everything down or creating more work because they don't understand it themselves.

It's valuable in private industry because employers assume the candidate has developed particular skills that will benefit the company. There is the anticipation of what is to be expected when the auditor's arrive. There's also the learned/instinctive ability to question things so there aren't massive year-end adjustments or surprises.

You can obtain these skills without ever going public. You'll likely need good managers/mentors to assist with your learning though. I have never been in public, but I have a great support team that has public experience or has plenty of experience dealing with auditors.

Do I wish I had public experience? Absolutely… sometimes. I missed the boat because I already had a family by the time I got deep enough into my accounting career. If I didn't have to take such a huge pay cut to do it, I would consider joining a non-big4 firm. I think the experience I already have and taking that to public would put me ahead of others. But… I'm happy where I'm at and I'm learning every day… so we'll see.

AUD - 92
BEC - 84
FAR - 89
REG - 84

Mailed application! Hoping to be licensed by year-end!

[Anonymous]

mla nailed it. The accounting world never stops evolving and is becoming more strict on guidelines and controls that the B4 people are used to. The mix of regulatory reporting, audit and industry knowledge is very valuable. I believe universities push working for the B4 because 1.They believe the rigorous environment you are exposed to helps develop people professionally and 2.To build up the network of the school with the B4 firms.

[tud20551]

Big 4 or Bust.

BEC - Passed

FAR - Ninja in Training

AUD - Ninja in Training

REG - Ninja in Training

[tud20551]

I personally think I'm better than you if you are not Big 4.

Best Resumes and Candidates get in.

If you are complaining it is because you don't get in.

Stop Being Jealous.

BEC - Passed

FAR - Ninja in Training

AUD - Ninja in Training

REG - Ninja in Training

[Anonymous]

@tud20551 – I am honestly not the least bit jealous…I graduated with honors and was one of the top students at my university (which has one of the top business schools in the country). I didn't even interview with a single public accounting firm. In fact, the only job I interviewed for was the job I'm in now.

I knew public accounting wasn't for me because of the long hours and because I wanted to find a place where I would feel comfortable staying once my husband and I decide to start a family. I was fortunate enough to land that type of job with the company I wanted right out of college.

I understand that the top candidates get Big 4. I'm not doubting that. My question in this thread is can you give me tangible evidence of how your actual professional experience in public accounting adds value to you as a candidate when you decide to leave public accounting (because most do). If you are one of the few people that is on partner track and truly wants to stay in public accounting your whole career, then this discussion really doesn't pertain to you.

I'm not going to start a long discussion with you, but your response to my question kind of proves to me my perception of many people who go the Big 4 route. Supposedly they are considered “the best of the best” and feel they are more qualified over other accountants, but I never understand what value Big 4 experience added to a resume (other than being able to put a Big 4 firm on your resume). I truly just wanted to hear other people's perceptions because I wanted to understand something I have no experience in!

[Anonymous]

Working in public, I've handled hundreds of assurance engagements and have had the opportunity to deal with all levels of management and board members. You get a lot of exposure in public and become familiar with not only the structure of many different companies, but also the internal controls and how/why companies operate the way they do. As an auditor, you learn about the risky areas and how to account for them properly according to GAAP. It's a great learning experience to understand the financials from a higher level which is why it's recommended to start in public and transfer to private later on in your career if you want the higher level positions. That's probably the most valuable experience I've gained from working in public.

On the other hand, private accounting you won't necessarily get the well-rounded exposure, but you do get to learn the details of the company's financials from an internal perspective. A person with a lot of experience coming from public may be familiar with ways to improve the system or make it more efficient since they've worked with several different companies rather than just one. And I agree, working in public you are looking at the financials from a top-down perspective, whereas again, an internal/private accountant won't necessarily be familiar with the end game or have that kind of exposure.

Not to mention, public accounting is all about deadlines and efficiency, day in and out. It's like boot camp training. Private tends to be more slack.

[Author]

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